Apple commits to free upgrades for iPhone and Apple TV

Apple's Q2 financial results are in, and along with the almost predictable profit and sales achievements -- $855 million in profits, 34% year over year growth, $12.6 billion cash on hand... you know, the usual -- Apple fleshed out a few details about two of its "closed" platforms, the iPhone and the Apple TV. Apple promises to "surprise and delight" users of both with new applications and software features as they go along, many of which will be free. Apple also noted that it's using "subscription accounting" to make sure it doesn't have to relive that 802.11n scenario of charging a nominal fee for upgrades. When asked about how widely the iPhone will be available in June, Apple didn't have a whole lot to say, other than they won't be able to predict demand until they start shipping -- we predict they'll sell a few.

[Julian @ Apr 25th 2007 5:39PM]

few million.

[Ben @ Apr 25th 2007 5:52PM]

Second Quarter huh? They must have a time machine because where I work we're just about to close the FIRST quarter.

[rip @ Apr 25th 2007 6:00PM]

er, it's very common for companies to have fiscal years that are different from calendar years. OFten this is because of what date a company was incorporated. However, there are also various other reasons to set the corporate year differently from the calendar year.

Apple's fiscal year ends in October. It begins in November. Therefore, this was Apple's second quarter.

[Ben @ Apr 25th 2007 6:03PM]

A lot of Fiscal years start in October making the end of March the 2nd quarter.

* 1st Quarter: October 1, 2006 – December 31, 2006
* 2nd Quarter: January 1, 2007 – March 31, 2007
* 3rd Quarter: April 1, 2007 – June 30, 2007
* 4th Quarter: July 1, 2007 – September 30, 2007

[PDubNYC @ Apr 25th 2007 6:05PM]

Ben
ooh, that's gotta sting, huh big guy? Did they just teach you about quarters, and u felt on top of the world, but alas, they forgot to mention fiscal years. Damn them! They made you make a total ass of yourself.

[brian fakier @ Apr 25th 2007 6:22PM]

Lets make more fun of the guy who never heard of a fiscal year.

If he didn't know that'd be fine, but once he used his lack of knowledge to make fun of the engadget writer he basically said, "im not just dumb, im dumber than dumb, and you know that bitch."

[Alex @ Apr 25th 2007 5:53PM]

those things will sell so fast...

[Max @ Apr 25th 2007 8:48PM]

i think they could have sold a lot more if the iPhone experience wasn't locked with Cingular service. That's the only reason i'm going to miss this Apple product. Cingular has a good reputation, but it lacks in the "plans fit consumer needs" category.

[Jeff @ Apr 25th 2007 5:56PM]

A million and then sales will fall through the floor. It's an early adopter/Apple fanboy type device. Once regular people see how impractical it is as a phone, how it's not as good of a music player as a real iPod, not as good a phone as a real phone, how it suffers all the same convergence problems as other convergence devices, how it costs way too much money and does less than a lot of comparable products, sales are going to collapse.

Not everything Apple does turns to gold.

[bleeka @ Apr 26th 2007 9:55AM]

This is from a thread about the iPod - from 2001, whne it was introduced
"All that hype for an MP3 player? Break-thru digital device? The Reality Distiortion Field™ is starting to warp Steve's mind if he thinks for one second that this thing is gonna take off."

That wasn't you by any chance, was it nostradamus? They said the same about the Macintosh, and the iMac 13 years later (that was going to fail because it did not have a floppy drive & usb ports!)
The iPhone will sell a million units in its first year. And it will continue to sell because Apple does not sit still - it will improve the iPhone over a short time - take a look at the iPod's short history. I think that a lot of people on wall street see that too. Anyone want to take bets on the million in one year prediciton?

[robmoff2 @ Apr 26th 2007 4:19PM]

jeff,
I know multipurpose gadgets have had problems for years, but let's not forget who we're talking about here. If anyone can pull off a miracle in this convergent device market it is the design team at apple. Granted I'm a fanboy and maybe even a zealot but I have come to expect near perfection from the boys of Infinite Loop.

[rip @ Apr 25th 2007 6:01PM]

Oops, I meant that it ends in September and begins in October.

[v_dogg @ Apr 26th 2007 12:53AM]

your acting like a 10 year old

[bounchfx @ Apr 25th 2007 6:18PM]

Jeff :

This is Apple not sony.

I have no doubt the mp3 features will be just as good, and I'm sure phone calling works fine.

And remember... OMGz handheld internets!1

[TechnicolourSquirrel @ Apr 26th 2007 2:45AM]

"Lets make more fun of the guy who never heard of a fiscal year."

No. Let's not.

[Silver @ Apr 25th 2007 6:42PM]

"It's an early adopter/Apple fanboy type device." - Jeff

Yeah Jeff, I seem to recall hearing a lot of the same a few years ago about another device you may have heard of: the iPod. And if ever there was a gadget in serious need of a reinvention, it's the cell phone. I've hated every cell phone I've ever owned or used. The iPhone, if it lives up to the promise, could be a real earth shaker.

I'll keep your quote and save it for a year or two. Then we can all have a good laugh about it.

[Bob @ Apr 25th 2007 8:10PM]

"...same a few years ago about another device you may have heard of: the iPod..."

I've read this same argument by other "experts" out there, and I really don't think that it applies. It is a completely different beast and relies on another party (AT&T). Now I'm not saying that it wont be a success, I just don't see the "well the iPod did it" to be all that valid.

[Ayle @ Apr 25th 2007 7:21PM]

Can we hope for the activation of a hidden 3g radio or gps chip on the iphone?

[Leonard Nimrod @ Apr 25th 2007 9:58PM]

No. That would not classify as a "software update". Though a firmware update is software, it's diferent since beast since it's turning on previously unused--and we saw with the paid 802.11n update--and unadvertised functionality. Sarbanes-Oxley regulates the additon of new features, a simple software update is not affected.

[Brian West @ Jul 1st 2007 10:52AM]

You do realize that the radio on this thing is more than likely a software radio so in theory it could be updated.

/b

[MrWhite @ Apr 25th 2007 7:30PM]

This brings the lolz, why is it Mac people are called fanboys and zealots, aren't windows people just as adament about windows? Which would make them fanboys and zealots wouldn't it. I mean really. Grow up people.

[Bloobie @ Apr 25th 2007 8:45PM]

No, they are just bitter. :)

[mikeguru @ Apr 25th 2007 8:08PM]

Interesting how some folks think they know so much about the sales potential a product that isn't even being sold/shipped yet. Apple "fanboys", as you put it, know a potentially better piece of technology when they see it, Jeff. An all-in-one device that includes a video iPod that also happens to be a breakthrough cell phone design that also includes a REAL web browser (Safari) and built-in WiFi for internet access is worth how much? The market and initial sales will ultimately prove your so-called analysis to be very wrong.

[o rly @ Apr 25th 2007 8:18PM]

Yes, an all in one device that lacks 3G, a hard keyboard, GPS, and third party development.

[mikeguru @ Apr 25th 2007 10:20PM]

No hard keyboard is an IMPROVEMENT - All current designs SUCK to use. (iPhone will use a "smart" touch screen interface). 3G is not widely available in the U.S. yet, so why add the cost of a feature that the infrastructure does not fully support? Third party applications development will (in all likelyhood) be monitored/screened by Apple to ensure that those products don't crash the device (like they do on a Treo). If you need GPS, BUY A GARMIN - The iPhone is first and foremost a CELL PHONE! The other features (Internet/Web and Video iPod) are BONUSES. Oh, and what should a 3G-capable, GPS-equipped Cell Phone with WiFi Internet/Web and Video iPod included cost? $1K? To put it another way, what does a handheld GPS cost? How about a Video iPod? And a touch-screen Cell Phone? Also, a WiFi equipped Internet Device? Add the cost off the aforementioned together. Better yet, go back and watch the ENTIRE iPhone Keynote Address. Perhaps THEN you'll get it . . . . .

[TechnicolourSquirrel @ Apr 26th 2007 2:47AM]

"Yes, an all in one device that lacks 3G, a hard keyboard, GPS, and third party development."

And the iPod had no FM tuner, no voice recording, no colour display, and less capacity than the highest Nomad.

So what's your point?

PC heads haven't figured it out yet. People don't want more features that are too hard to use or don't work reliably. Most people are much more satisfied with just a few features that work exactly the way you would want them to.

Time is money. Nobody wants to take the time to learn your brain-dead interfaces anymore.

[whatever @ Apr 26th 2007 5:15AM]

Here is a thought...

Would it be very difficult to come up with accessories which can do the GPS processing part (antenna + some hardware) and then plug it into the iphone externally and use some mapping software on the iphone?

You could leave the accessory in your car all the time and whenever you want, plug in the iphone and you have a car entertainment system + gps.

Sounds possible right? In my opinion, its not always a good idea to merge all hardware into one.

[Darnell @ Apr 25th 2007 8:36PM]

"Yes, an all in one device that lacks 3G, a hard keyboard, GPS, and third party development."

Eh? It has Google maps. I think that should work for 90% of the pople who need directions. Apple has also said it would work with authorized 3rd party (i.e. like the iPod games). And really--if you've ever been to the Apple download page--you'll finid that there isn't a shortage of nifty little apps. I'm sure the same would apply here as well. It does lack 3G but how many consumers will be downloading a ton of documents.
I won't comment on the keyboard as of now just because we really don't know how good/bad it'll be to type on.

[o rly @ Apr 26th 2007 10:58AM]

"Eh? It has Google maps."

Duh? Google Maps != GPS. They are not on the same level.

[Alber1690 @ Apr 25th 2007 9:11PM]

Why Cingular? Why?...I thought we liked eachother enough you wouldn't go on to the other side. I hope Microsoft/Cingular continue to get along in other projects...I was so dissapointed when I heard of it...if it was Sprint or something...it would be a different story, but I have Cingular and I bet I'm going to start to get all of this marketing for Apple's little iPhone.

[Dorian Mattar @ Apr 26th 2007 12:08AM]

Why do people keep talking about the damn lack of hard keyboard? Those tiny keys are useless!

That's the only reason the Treo is still around, cause it has a touch screen with larger buttons. Our CEO and others at that caliber, refuses to use the Dash or the Q, simply cause they are not touch screen.

Touch screen as adaptable, hard keys are not and they are out!

[Dorian Mattar @ Apr 26th 2007 12:20AM]

Why do people keep talking about the damn lack of hard keyboard? Those tiny keys are useless!

That's the only reason the Treo is still around, cause it has a touch screen with larger buttons. Our CEO and others at that caliber, refuses to use the Dash or the Q, simply cause they are not touch screen.

Touch screen as adaptable, hard keys are not and they are out!

[sdf632 @ Apr 25th 2007 9:47PM]

I'm sure Apple will make a concerted effort to hit it off with the iPhone but I think it's about time they had a flop.

With iPod, Apple was breaking into a brand new market that did not have a major presence at the time. MP3's were so new that there weren't established standards or perceptions by consumers. In addition, like someone else pointed out, they weren't dependent on AT&T as a partner. With the iPhone, they are challenging a crowded and highly competitive market structure where they have NO previous experience. Just the reliability/quality issues will be a challenge with something at the level of Apple's typical build quality and with a phone of this complexity. I mean, when people say that iPhone will be a huge hit, a lot of the time they have no idea as to what Apple's actually facing. Maybe if they had iPhone manufactured by Samsung or Nokia or something, it could be a huge hit, but just on manufacturing, I wish Apple luck with this, because they are going to need it. In addition, when iPhone hits shelves, really it's going to be outdated the moment it hits. It doesn't have 3G, or GPS and really, has nothing that's truly innovative. Other cell phone makers will easily and quickly match whatever leads Apple may have, and likely crowd Apple out if necessary.

and in case people want to mention that I'm an apple hater, i'm actually pro apple. They are certainly some of the best innovators out there and deserve credit for years of being shafted by M$. It's just that this is a place where Apple has way too much going against it.

[TechnicolourSquirrel @ Apr 26th 2007 3:00AM]

I love it when people proclaim the iPhone market is different and Apple can't succeed in it. There were plenty of other MP3 players before the iPod as PC guys used to love pointing out back in the early days. The would rattle off all the names and proclaim that the iPod is no innovation at all, conveniently omitting the human interface as a field for innovation. They don't mention such devices anymore because it is now plain that iPod crushed them all in their sleep. Now they want us to believe that Apple entered an empty market in a cakewalk. If it was so easy then how come Rio and Creative hadn't already eaten up the whole pie? Because nobody loved their players, that's why.

How many people do you know that love their cel phones and aren't constantly complaining about them? Everyone I know complains about their cel phone. Everyone.

Just like the MP3 player market before the iPod, this market is still wide open where it counts.

[johnny @ Apr 26th 2007 12:09AM]

Apple doesn't comment on a lot of things, do they?

[o rly @ Apr 26th 2007 11:18AM]

@ TechnicolourSquirrel : "So what's your point?"

Are you slow? The point is that it's not an "all in one device" that it's being touted as. I thought it was simple, maybe not simple enough for a "non-PC head" like you.

--

mikeguru, your posts make you seem like such a simpleton. "3G-capable, GPS-equipped Cell Phone with WiFi Internet/Web and Video iPod included cost? $1K?"

They already exist and don't cost nearly $1,000. http://www.engadget.com or http://www.engadgetmobile.com for more information. What are you a guru of?

--

@ Dorian Mattar : "Why do people keep talking about the damn lack of hard keyboard? Those tiny keys are useless! That's the only reason the Treo is still around, cause it has a touch screen with larger buttons."

and BlackBerry's with their small keys, lack of touchscreens, and largest corporate market share for a PDA or smartphone are still around because?

--

@ whatever : "Here is a thought...Would it be very difficult to come up with accessories which can do the GPS processing part (antenna + some hardware) and then plug it into the iphone externally and use some mapping software on the iphone?"

Here's an answer, that's third party. TomTom Navigator, iGo, Microsoft Streets & Trips, iGuidance, etc are third party programs. http://www.gpspassion.com for hardware & software reviews. In case you're wondering, GPS receivers cost less than $50 and use bluetooth.

[zoara @ Apr 26th 2007 10:19AM]

whatever: That's perfectly possible, Tomtom have been doing it for years with Palm devices (including the Treo), Windows mobile devices and a smattering of other phones from Nokia and the like.

I'd like to see exactly the same on an iPhone as I use my TomTom / Treo sat nav very regularly.

[Darren Wilson @ Apr 26th 2007 9:02AM]

Will it be compatiable with the George Foreman iGrill though?????? ;o)

[Michael de Agonia @ Apr 26th 2007 9:42AM]

For the one who asked about potential future GPS capabilities in iPhone:

Dude, with the entire interface being software, it's entirely possible that one day we'll be able to download iMaps.app from iTunes, load it into iPhone, buy a small piece of hardware (think Nike+), stick that little piece of hardware in the trunk of your car, pair it wirelessly through bluetooth, and boom! Instant GPS. Then every time iPhone comes into range of your car, it autopairs with bluetooth to the GPS unit.

Between the software interface and bluetooth pairing capabilities, the iPhone's potential is mind-blowing. Think about it like this: every year, computers are getting smaller and smaller. Remember the awe when you first saw the Cube? Same awe when you saw the box the Mac mini shipped in. It's only a matter of time before you start carrying your computer around with you, for every day usage such as email, chatting, and browsing the web. The iPhone is tomorrow coming today. ... Um... late June.

:)

[nikster @ Apr 26th 2007 2:56PM]

a few comments:

- iPhone success - yes, it will be a huge success because smart phones today are just as bad as mp3 players were before the iPod. they have all the features, it's just that they don't work.

I just spent hours trying simple things like syncing music and video to my Nokia N73. PC Suite crashes all over the place, the videos don't play (oh, can only be 15FPS, well back to re-encoding then!), the music doesn't auto-update (oh, have to select "update music library" from options?!). In short, it SUCKS, and I haven't even tried all features. It's slow as hell too.

- Why Cingular is easy: It needs to be GSM, which leaves only cingular and t-mobile. World markets, hello. And T-Mobile probably tried to add their pink logo to the front - instant deal killer. Or, more realistically, they were too small.

[neen @ Apr 26th 2007 4:28PM]

Funny, Google Maps supports GPS. Don't believe me? Go download it to your Windows Mobile device...yes you will need a separate device to connect it to, but it works with GPS.

[Christian @ Apr 26th 2007 4:18PM]

Here's what I don't understand about the iPhone; The device is neat (hell it's beautiful) but people say the iPhone doesn't need 3G because it isn't widely supported. They then make the whole wifi argument like there are all these free hot spots you can stroll by to get connected. Maybe that world exist in San Fransisco, or silicon valley, but for the rest of us, free wifi is an urban myth. The only real revolutionary aspect to the iPhone is the web interaction. But, guess what, it loads at dial up speeds which is abdominal (EDGE sucks). If I wanted to connect with wifi in my home, I'd probably just use my computer and if I have to pay for a fast connection when out, I probably won't be surfing much. And if you still say that a $600 iPod doesn't need 3G because 3G proliferation on AT&T's network is slim, well a popular selling premium device might just generate enough users of the service to warrant a full fledge switch to an all high speed network (ala Verizon). I like the phone, I want the phone, but until it catches up with the 2006 technology in version 1.5 or 2.0(how long ago did Verizon roll out the high speed network), I've got no choice but to pass. I mean, who has $600 to blow on dial up technology?

[SCguitarpro @ Apr 27th 2007 6:49PM]

http://www.theonion.com/%63ontent/news_briefs/apple_hard_at_work_making

Reading something like that makes me afraid to buy the first generation...